Chris: 0:00

I love, okay, well, first of all, I have to clarify something. Mom bought Storm of the Century so she could finish watching it too.

Brandon: 0:22

Hello, and welcome to the premier episode of the Cup of Tea Critiques Podcast. I'm your host, Brandon Chaisson, and like always, I'll be joined today by the great team that brings you cupofteacritiques.com. We are super excited to get started on our podcast where we will share our unique perspectives on several different areas in movies and television. At Cup of Tea Critiques, we encourage critical viewing of cinematic presentations so you can decide for yourself if they're your cup of tea. Here on the Cup of Tea Critiques Podcast, we will dive even deeper into the productions and subjects that we cover on our website, engaging in conversation and sharing our unique perspectives on each topic. Ready for a deep look with a deep brew? This week's topic, "Horror or Thriller? What Makes Up the Difference?" I'm so looking forward to getting to this topic. So without further ado, let's get started. In case you're unaware, Cup of Tea Critiques is a family business, and I'm so happy to introduce my family to you. I'm here with my brother, Chris, mother, Reba, my father, Terry. I'm going to go ahead and kick it to Chris, because this is a Crumpets article you did for us on the site, and I really enjoyed going through it. I love all the different things you shared about it, so let me go ahead and just kick it to you. And you and you kind of tell us how you got started with this, and let's get this ball rolling.

Chris: 1:46

Yeah. So I saw Heretic a few weeks ago, which is for those who don't know, it's an A24, movie starring Hugh Grant, where a couple of Mormon missionaries or teenage girls who are going door to door, go up to his estate and, you know, knock on the door, you know. And he invites them inside, you know. And he starts kind of grilling them on their, on their belief system. And it kind of goes, it goes in a lot of different directions, but essentially, he's he's trapped them. He's trapped them in his mansion, and he's testing their, testing their faith and their knowledge of their faith. And I thought it was pretty scary. I thought it was pretty scary. But, you know, I did listen to a podcast called the Roger & Me podcast, and they, they described it as more of a thriller than a horror. And I thought that would, that would probably hurt my soul if I directed a horror. Well, it was more of another genre. And so it just got me thinking, what are what are the differences, really? Because, I mean, and what is it? Is it a failure if you seek, set out to create a horror movie, and somebody calls it a great something else. So I just, I just wanted to talk about the differences between horror and thriller with you all today.

Brandon: 3:51

Yeah, I kind of, I kind of agree with that. I think for those that I feel don't necessarily dive into the genre as a whole, they probably view them both as being merged and one in the same, but your article here actually does a good job of helping us differentiate between the two. And so is that something you actively thought about, like as part of this process, or do you feel like you discovered that more as you wrote the article? And then can you also, like, kind of share some of the things you found?

Chris: 4:19

Yeah, I mean, well, a lot of a lot of movies are advertised as being a blend of two genres these days anyway. And you know, in this, in this kind of, in this world of trying to make a footprint online, it behooves everybody to just slap as many labels on their thing as they possibly can. And I see stuff all the time that's labeled Horror, Family, Adult. But you're like, well, those, those don't all mesh. I don't. I think you're, I think you're trying to game the system here. But I think generally you'll see horror and thriller paired together. But, you know, I think about some of the some some thrillers, even in recent years that I like, or horrors and or horror movies in recent years that I've I've really liked, and I think there's a pretty distinct difference when you start going into how, you know, how they try to affect the audience, how they try to make the audience feel, and you know what best, what do they want you to feel when you leave. What do they want to do you feel while you're watching it and and who are they trying to get? Who are they trying to get to? I mean, they, I think they're two actually pretty different audiences. And so, I mean, the first thing when I asked my friends, what do you think the difference between horror and thriller is, and they they immediately just said, jump scares. And as we know jump scares is, we do that all the time. In our own lives, you hide behind the wall, sneak out and that's what they're that's what they're doing. But in a lot of horror movies, it's, it's, it's, it's like a rhythmic, based response like and when you watch enough of them, you start to kind of anticipate it. But, you know, there's like a moment of silence, and then they try to get you where you think they you release the tension, and then, and then they hit you with a jump scare, something in the background, or some very loud, you know, horn note or something like that, and they they accentuate it like that, and you're not going to see that in a thriller, necessarily, necessarily.

Brandon: 6:30

Yeah, I got to agree with you. I I found as I was reading your article, it helped explain to me why I don't watch necessarily, the traditional horrors as much. I don't frown on it at all. I just found that I tend to lean towards the thrillers. And you talk about it in here, about how it's edge of your seat. Mom and Dad, I attribute my enjoyment of thrillers more because you guys, as we were growing up, you expanded the options that we had. Because as a kid, you watch whatever action or cartoon it is. And then as you showed us more of dramas and suspense and all those kinds of things, that's what honed in on me, realizing that when it comes to being scared, I prefer to be scared in a thriller manner, and having that edge of your seat deal. And I don't know if you guys was that kind of intentional, or have you guys found that same thing for yourselves?

Reba: 7:20

Well, for me, for me, Brandon, it was certainly intentional, because I wasn't going to watch horror, Okay. I'll be totally clear about that. As I wrote in an email a couple of months ago, when I discovered Chris watching Storm of the Century when he was about 10 years old, I freaked. It was a very, very scary movie. The devil had come to this small town and basically said, the only way he would leave is if one of the townspeople gave up their their own, their, I'm sorry, their youngest son. It was a three-part, I think it was three or four part mini series back in the 90s, and I would not let Chris finish watching that movie, and he got very, very upset with me. Long story short is I've just never been a fan of horror. I've never been a fan of horror. Chris cringes when I say that, but I love suspense. Though I do love suspense. I love a good thrill.

Brandon: 8:44

Well, that's where Chris, Chris and I sharing that, and we both love horror. Matter of fact, whenever I see an advertisement for a horror movie upcoming, your mother always says, "you and Chris, enjoy."

Reba: 9:00

That's true

Brandon: 9:01

I feel like everybody every time that we know you two are going to be around that we know we'll lose, some time to the two you going to the theater to catch one.

Terry: 9:16

Yeah. To me, horror. I'm more, uh, psychological horror. I I like that more than the blood and guts. I mean, there's a certain amount of blood and gore that that's tolerable as far as horror is concerned. But for me, horror is more I enjoy more of the stories that are that kind of delve with your mind and possibilities, the what ifs and things like that, that that truly horrify you. Thrillers. Yeah, I love thrillers in that it's usually the adrenaline rush where you're trying to anticipate what's going to happen, or there's this constant tension of what's going on, which, yeah, there's a little difference between that and the kind of tension that you get from something that's more or less than a horror genre.

Reba: 10:08

Yeah, I think about, when I think about horror, I think, I mean, Storm of the Century was bad enough, which, to be fair, folks, I did eventually buy the video for Chris so he could see it. So he thought I was Mean Mom and I eventually did buy the video so he could finish this thing. But more power to him. But I do on occasion, sit down and watch some of the scary stuff with Terry and Chris. But I have to say, when I saw the girl come through the TV, I was done.

Chris: 10:44

In the ring?

Reba: 10:45

That that was it.

Chris: 10:48

Killed the whole genre for you.

Reba: 10:49

Chris hates it when I say I can't stand horror, but I'm just keeping it real. It's just not my thing. I love

Chris: 10:57

Okay, well, first of all, I gotta clarify something. Mom bought Storm of the Century so she could finish watching it too because

Reba: 11:10

No, that's not true, not true. I didn't want you to continue to be mad at me. That's why your dad and I sat down and watched it with you, and you're right. It turned out to be very, very good. It turned out to be very, very good I have to say.

Chris: 11:26

Exactly. I think the thrillers that were coming to mind for me were, you know, I was thinking Speed, right?

Terry: 11:34

Yeah.

Chris: 11:35

Argo. You know, you know Argo, won the Oscar a few years back. You know, one I heard the other day that just came to mind was Cellular, the one with Chris Evans on the phone, like him basically called. And I feel like thrillers are so often just, it's arace against time. Basically, you know, someone's in danger. You it's, it's established, you know that our hero has this long to find somebody or get the villain or defuse the bomb. It's always racing against time. And I feel like horror movies will just put you in this universe where it's a lot of times it's time isn't really a factor as much as just this inescapable environment that you're in.

Terry: 12:24

Yeah

Chris: 12:27

And I feel like that's that's kind of a difference that I would, I would, and because of that, through this, can feel very real world. Like a kidnapping feels like a very real thing. A bomb being planted somewhere feels like a very real thing. Horrors, it's very abstract. It's a lot of it's ghosts, it's demons, it's just even, even if it's just a regular human being, they're very strange and they're very isolated and and I think horrors, thrive off of this just universe that feels almost separate from ours in a way that thrillers don't.

Brandon: 13:04

I love that you, both you and dad said some interesting things there, because, like when you talked about existing in the universe all by itself, it took me back to Thirteen Ghosts. And I think that might be the last horror movie I really actively like, signed up for. And I really, actually, really enjoyed it. Um, Matthew Lillard was in that one, and I just found it. I just, I don't know why I think, I think, I think it's because, in general, I enjoyed a lot of the things I saw him in, and he's been in a few different movies like that. But in this particular instance, you hit the nail on the head about it existing in a whole different world for me. So I think that's the perfect example I can draw from that. Dad also brought up another piece that that you touch on on in this article as well, Chris, is that there's sub genres within the horror genre, because we talked about horror versus thriller, and then dad said psychological thriller. And like, it just, Mom, when you brought up The Ring. I thought of the ring as more of a psychological thriller, because, to your point, when it came out of the the TV that's put it in its own universe, or whatever, to stick with the horror genre itself, but prior to that, we're kind of on the edge of our seat because we understand that we had so many days before the worst was supposed to happen. So that's where I think that it's exactly where dad's talking about and I don't know it helps me to understand that there are still pieces within the horror genre that I can still attach to, and not just say I blatantly ignore this. I don't know, get somebody take over on this, because that's all the things that are going through my head right now.

Reba: 15:05

To be fair, the plot for The Ring went away with me when she came out of the television. I don't even know what that movie was about anymore. Once she came out of the television that was it. I left the room.

Terry: 15:19

In terms of psychological horror, like one of the classic ones, for me, is a Nightmare on Elm Street, because here you had someone invading someone's dreams. It wasn't so much the gore of it being a horror, but it's the fact that someone could actually invade your psyche while you're asleep. You know? That that's an example of what I would consider psychological horror that piques my interest.

Brandon: 15:51

So two quick things, Mom, you talked about the the way you lost it with the with The Ring, and you could do with my, my one of my college classmates and I, the way we got around that was, we just said, We just turned the TV against the wall at night. That way, if she came out, she'd still be stuck. But separately, too, Dad, you brought up, you brought up Friday the 13th. And I'm thinking about one thing Chris talked about too, with the the blood aspect of horror versus thriller. And they really get me in that scene where they kill the the woman in the bed, and you got this geyser of blood going up. And Chris, I want to, I'm actually, I'll throw it to anybody here, the whole idea of the blood when it comes to these movies. What do you guys think on that? I think Chris touched on that really well, because in that case, it's just a mess of blood everywhere. Whereas with thrillers, it seems like, Chris to, your point in the article, the blood has a lot more to do with the characters than it does to necessarily, like just being a big explosion or something.

Chris: 16:55

You know, I think a lot of times in thrillers the blood is is, you know, the blood, the gore, the injuries. It's directly related to shrinking the odds of the main character being able to succeed. I mean, to take it to TV like 24 you know, Jack Bauer gets shot in the arm. Well, it's gonna be a lot harder to save the day with a bullet in your arm. So it's generally worth I think there's a lot of scenes and thrillers where you see the main character nursing an injury that they have or nursing an injury that somebody they're trying to protect got. And so and it might you know it they some of them are grosser than others. Some of them, it depends on however the filmmaker chooses to depict it, but it's usually okay, how are they going to what are they going to do now? What is, what is John McClane going to do now that his feet are all cut up by all this glass, right? Yeah, and in horror, the blood just doesn't, doesn't. It seems it's just to appeal to audience members who really love horror movies. And they, there's just some people who love the blood and guts of it all. They they like the effects. They like that. And so what you're seeing on screen doesn't really have anything to do with the plot. It's just appealing to the people watching the watching the movie itself. And you know, it makes me think some people - I don't relate necessarily, even though I like horror. But some people just like, you know. I, when I worked, you know, I worked at a COVID testing site. And one of the nurses there followed this account that showed like these, you know, kind of grisly injuries that people had from like car accidents and stuff like that. And she and she showed it to somebody else who also followed the same account, and it was just like, I just can't really relate to that. But some people, like some people like the bloody guns of it all, it doesn't bother them. And I think that's what a lot of what you see in horror, the blood isn't necessarily impacting the story. It's just appealing to the audience.

Reba: 19:08

Our aesthetic tastes vary.

Chris: 19:10

For sure. It can make, it can make for an a memorable scene. I mean, you know, to the point I think Nightmare on Elm Street, he gets sucked through a bed, and then you just see more blood than it's probably in the human body.

Terry: 19:22

Yeah, right.

Brandon: 19:23

Yes.

Chris: 19:24

Feeling. And I just feel like, in a thriller, you wouldn't see something like that, and just be like, Oh, this is it would take you out of because you're primed for a real world story when you're watching a thriller. So you would see something like that, and you'd be like, that's ridiculous. But in the in the horror movie, you go for it. So yeah.

Brandon: 19:42

I love that you brought that up, Chris, because another thing you talk about in your in your article is weaponry. And I think that lends right into the blood argument. Because I think of a movie like Psycho, where we know that the woman, we know that the killer, the weapon is a knife and whatnot. And then you think about Texas Chainsaw Massacre. It's in the name we all know, what Freddie uses with the claws, like, there's just, there's obviously a weapon aspect to it, and what's realistic versus unrealistic. But I always growing up, I viewed Psycho as a horror movie, and now it sounds like it's actually more nuanced than that. So is it possible that weaponry can still that, like a horror movie, can still use regular weapons you think? Or do you think it usually has to do something a little bit extra?

Chris: 20:43

Oh no. I think, yeah, I think there's crossover, for sure. And I think I kind of hinted at this in my article, that you know, the benefits to having this kind of abstract world and fighting you know fighting the evil with with these kind of unorthodox weapons, is you don't have to, like, pay for real weapons. How do we fit the exorcist in the budget? Well, just, you know, put a Bible in there. They're gonna fight it with the Bible. So, yeah, but I think there's crossover, for sure. And I mean, there's, you know, to the point, I think there's something a little more frightening about a stabbing than, say, a shooting, right? Like it's there's, like, a personal aspect to it. There's a proximity, yeah, so the watching someone do that is probably scarier than, say, the military violence you might see in a movie or something like that.

Brandon: 22:03

Good point. Good point.

Reba: 22:04

As I read your article, Chris, I thought a lot about how horror and thriller get conflated, and I myself use them interchangeably, and I wonder if that's wrong. And I was wondering, you know, to what degree should we, I mean, is it fair to slice and dice, or is it okay to conflate or, I mean, how should how should we, I'm trying to think about how to use this in our writing and everyday speech. Should we be correct? Should we speak correctly about what's a horror and what's a thriller in our writing and in our speech, or or is it okay to use the two as if they're one and the same

Brandon: 22:53

It's funny you chose

Chris: 22:55

I'm sorry, go ahead.

Brandon: 22:56

I was just gonna say to Mom, I think it's funny that she originally chose to say slice and dice on the subject matter, but that being said.

Reba: 23:04

Okay

Brandon: 23:05

A response to what what you were saying, though, Mom, I think goes into another aspect to this that I thought we we that you and Dad really can kind of comment on. I wonder if part of that might be that horror as a genre itself has transformed from what it was in the past, when all of the classic ones that came out were in the past, versus what we know of today. So can you, can you maybe speak to that? And maybe that actually leads us to the some of the answers right now?

Reba: 23:33

Well, I think I'm sorry. Was that to Chris, or is it okay if I just comment real quick.

Brandon: 23:38

That was both to you and Dad, actually.

Reba: 23:40

I think so. I think here, the big thing for me with horror, like I said, I don't care much for the blood and guts. I really don't. For me, the story has to say something. And I find with a lot of the older with a lot of the older films, there wasn't really a statement being made. There were no strong themes. What I like about the present day stuff is there the story is having something to say. And I think that should be the point of writing a story, as opposed to just presenting something that would something for shock value. So, for example, your dad spoke earlier about psychological thrillers. I think about Alfred Hitchcock, who was a genius, a genius with in psychological thrillers, The Birds and such. So I think there are few in the past that were really good. But for the most part, I think the rest of it was blood and guts and didn't really have a lot to say.

Terry: 24:47

I find it very interesting that I've said psychological horror and both of you, psychological thriller in reference to me saying, describing psychological horror.

Reba: 24:58

See what I mean. I can. I conflate the two. Chris, correct me, am I wrong here? Fix me Chris!

Chris: 25:06

I think, I think it's, um, I really think it's, it's it. You can, you can tell, I think it's a lot related to, what is it? What is this movie going for? And I think you can, you can kind of get that from, like, how they, well, how do they market this? That's, that's kind of a big thing. I mean, you can almost, I would almost say you could tell from just the tone of voice of the voiceover, narrator and the trailer. Is he doing that? That really deep thing you hear with horror movies all the time, is he, I mean, just, how do they, how do they even cut up that two minutes? Like, how are they wanting you to, who are they trying to entice? Because those are my completely different crowds. And another thing I mentioned, thrillers are probably going to have, like, an A-list actor in there. You know.

Brandon: 26:00

He beat me to it. Go ahead, bro.

Chris: 26:02

Argo had been Affleck speed, which I mentioned earlier. I had Keanu Reeves and Sandra Bullock. And, you know, they had these recognizable faces. And a lot of horror movies, it's a budget restriction or just A-listers don't want to do them. A lot of them have lesser known actors, because they're, you're trying to get in under the budget, or maybe, maybe get the bigger, bigger name actors and actresses don't feel like it's a good, good enough use of their talent. So

Brandon: 26:34

I feel like

Terry: 26:35

Interesting

Brandon: 26:36

Oftentimes

Terry: 26:36

I think,

Brandon: 26:37

Sorry, I'll be real quick to Chris's point, I think that what you notice is that in a lot more horror films, they seem, to me, more like a jumping off to careers, or like somebody very early getting into the cinematic world.

Terry: 26:50

That's exactly what I was about to say Brandon.

Brandon: 26:52

Yeah, go, go for it. Dad.

Terry: 26:55

Yeah. That's exactly what I was about to say. Is that it's funny how many people that become, quote, unquote, A-list actors start out in a horror or thriller genre or more so horror, I think it depends on how you feel about what an A-list actor described as. But Jamie Lee Curtis, you know, to name one started out in a horror genre for the most part, and several others. But yeah, I think it's interesting how many of them have, kind of early in their careers, gone into horror and then become a more well known actor.

Brandon: 27:42

Yeah, that's exactly what I was going to say. I mean, like to name some more actors like Freddie Prinze Jr, when he did his he went his foray with it, with the I think it was him and Sarah Michelle Gellar who eventually ended up married. But they were, did I Know What You Did Last Summer and things like that. So Jessica bill with Texas Chainsaw Massacre. So it's funny, because we've seen them in a lot of other things since then, but like their first time on the big screen did seem to be popping off in some sort of horror movie.

Terry: 28:12

Yeah. Matthew Lillard, as you mentioned earlier.

Brandon: 28:15

Yep, yes, exactly. I want to, I think I want to go with one last thing here, because we're running short on time. Now I want to say, after this discussion, Dad, it's funny, you pointed out how you did say psychological horror. Mom and I said psychological thriller. So it kind of gives this the answer to this question. But at the at the conclusion of all this, exactly explain, within this, this, the context of this conversation, what is your cup of tea when it comes to horror?

Terry: 28:43

Horror? I again, I like the horror movies that kind of play with your mind. And as Chris pointed out, you're in this other worldly sort of situation. It really, really piques my interest, when a horror movie is not about someone getting their throat slashed or something like that, but more how it affects the person, the quote, unquote victims or the people in the movie psychologically. How are we going to deal with this and how it stretches the realm of possibility. It stretches your thinking. That's what I really like about a good, to me, a good horror movie is one that stretches your thinking.

Reba: 29:31

What's your favorite?

Terry: 29:32

My favorite one? Oh, that's hard to say. I have a few that are at the top of list. Like I said, Nightmare on Elm Street because it was one of the early ones that dealt with this whole notion of the horror coming into your mind, more so than the actual people being slashed and murdered. And another one, and I can't remember, Chris and I went to see it. A Cabin in the Woods, is that it?

Brandon: 30:03

I remember that.

Terry: 30:04

Yeah, that was another one that I thought was really good, because it was not your conventional horror movie.

Chris: 30:13

Yeah. I mean, To your point, I think self aware, like self aware horror movies, you know, are the ones that that that probably shine through. I think about, you know, I think, Well, my favorite is, is Psycho. But I also think about what you mentioned earlier, Thirteen Ghosts. There's, it's, it's a, it's a very goofy horror movie where they, where they kind of reference some of the things we were talking about, like the the idea of horror movies being in this self contained world, or this other world having this other worldly effect. This is all occurring in, you know, the basement of of one house. And if you, you know, venture five minutes that way, it's completely it's real life again, right? And, you know, and Matthew Lillard, it even says something to that effect, as he's talking to the babysitter, and, you know, she's going, or the nanny, and she's like, what this is all happening in this basement? And he's like, What is it with you people? If this was next door, I wouldn't give a crap. I think especially horror movies that can kind of wear different hats, that can, like, make you laugh here and there. They could. They can come up with a line. Psycho has a line. A boy's best friend is his mother, like they they'll have something memorable about them. The Ring has the girl going through the TV. Like, I think, just the ones that can kind of have a moment or a phrase that is just becomes iconic. And I think it's like, I like Psycho, because it has all that. It has the shower scene, it has, you know, the quotes, it has the surprise ending that they set up so well, I actually knew the ending, and when I watched it, I forgot it because it was so well executed. So yeah.

Terry: 32:02

And then to add one more, probably would be classic horror I guess, maybe, The Birds, the Alfred Hitchcock one, because that is another thing you think about, the possibility of birds turning on humans and you're outnumbered. How in the world do you deal with something like that? And then at the very end, things change, and they, quote, unquote, go back to normal. But will you ever be normal again? Will you always look over your shoulder as what happened? Why did this happen? Will it happen again?

Brandon: 32:38

Good point. Good point. What about mom? What do you got for us?

Reba: 32:42

My favorite one was Michael Jackson's Thriller.

Terry: 32:49

That's interesting. That is a short film, short horror film.

Reba: 32:53

Yeah, Michael Jackson's Thriller was my favorite. I'll add another one. I thought Storm of the Century was very good. Having said that I would never watch it again. I watched it once and I was one and done with that one.

Brandon: 33:09

I admit I enjoyed Storm of the Century thriller. I think that was a good call out Mom, because it's a that was a short film that was pretty well done too and is a benchmark of how music videos get measured even today. So Thirteen ghosts is my favorite because it was fun and like since I don't dive into that aspect of the horror genre very much, that's what I kind of lean into. I also remember, and I won't call it a good one, but Joy Ride was another one that I remember. I laughed along with it a lot. Maybe that's how not serious I took the movie. But I remember watching that. And and then going through all of this, I'll say, like a psychological thriller, as opposed to a psychological horror for myself, Taking Lives. Taking Lives was another one that kept me on the edge of my seat, that I really enjoyed. So that's where I would say. I that would be more of my cup of tea. I think movies like taking lives are definitely ones that I like to jump into a lot more, but overall, if it's going to be something horror, I jump into, I hope it's something that's maybe got some boo scary with a little bit of fun to it. Well, that's going to wrap up our first edition of the Cup of Tea Critiques Podcast. We hope you enjoyed listening as much as we enjoyed sharing today's conversation. Honestly, we could go on and on like we do at our dinner table, but we look forward to you joining us again next week for another great discussion. You can stay in the loop on all things COTC by subscribing on our website, at cupofteacritiques.com. You can also find us on Facebook. Check out our Instagram@cupofteacritiques, and on Letterboxed at COTCritiques. For Reba, Terry, and Chris, I'm Brandon. We'll see you next week for another deep look with the deep brew.